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A couple things:

1) I’d like to see additional measures beyond dB. A 50dB consistent white noise does not bother me (and may even enhance my sleep) but an intermittent off/on sound of the same magnitude has a very different effect

2) what is the accuracy of the consumer metrics compared to medical benchmarks? In other words, how reliable are the sleep measures of consumer devices? Anecdotally, I’ve noticed my watch thinks I’m sleeping sometimes when I watch a movie, and I’ve heard MDs say the metrics aren’t accurate enough to make strong conclusions.

I don't know how to state this well but I find the fact that nearly all new apartment buildings in California are only allowed to be built on busy streets very frustrating. I'm guessing it's part nimby-ism and part zoning but every time I see a new apartment complex it's next to the busiest streets in the city (LA, SF). It's like many things, if you want health you must be rich. If you can't afford a house then F.U. You get a loud apartment with constant traffic noise.

I *almost* feel like it should be illegal to build them next to the freeway like

Those ones just north of SFO next to the 110: https://maps.app.goo.gl/sAkUMhmnutZ1jFd27

The ones in downtown LA next to the 110: https://maps.app.goo.gl/4mBVLo12hLR4EwU16

The ones north of LAX at Howard Hughes: https://maps.app.goo.gl/Z8bnB7wR5jDBddhg6

I don't actually think I think they should be illegal but dang it, I wish there were more options for new apartments. In LA there are lots of older apartment buildings in quiet residential neighborhoods built 50+ years ago.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/KMLav1zLiQZK6T8L6

https://maps.app.goo.gl/aUH52rBAbaHExjzB6

They are no longer allowed to be built AFAICT.

FYI, there's been tons of research of the effects of noise on sleep from different sources. There have been studies ranging from in-lab experiments, to in-home experiments with artificial and natural sources. If you're interested, some resources:

Institute of Noise Control Engineering Digital library: https://www.inceusa.org/publications/ince-digital-library/ (papers older than 10 years old are available free)

Federal Interagency Committee on Aviation Noise: https://fican1.wordpress.com/findings/ (focuses on aviation noise)

Acoustical Society of America Lay Language Papers: https://acoustics.org/lay-language-papers/ (search for "sleep" -- the ASA has a full library of more detailed research but the documents cost money unless you're an ASA member)

World Health Organization guidelines on noise - https://iris.who.int/bitstream/handle/10665/343936/WHO-EURO-... (doesn't get into specifics on research on sleep, but does refer recommended limits to sleep disturbance)

NIH has done a bunch of research on sleep disturbance from noise, you would need to search through their library

edit (one more): TRB/National Academies https://nap.nationalacademies.org/search/?rpp=20&ft=1&term=n...

A lot of the stuff that posters are asking for have in fact been done, it just takes some digging through the research sites to find them. There's a lot of variation in the data, the hypothesis is that sleep sensitivity varies a lot based on various physical factors (age being a big one).

I’ve spent years “fixing” my sleep. Things I recommend:

* a sleep tracker. I love AutoSleep - https://apps.apple.com/us/app/autosleep-track-sleep-on-watch...

* Any kind of white noise. I use an air purifier at home, and a little pocket size white noise machine when I travel.

* find and eliminate any noises in your home. Computers, fridges, squeaky doors, etc.

* find and eliminate any lights. Especially stupid power and status LEDs. Bedroom should be pitch black at night. Electrical tape works well for this.

* Blackout curtains

* cheap eye mask

* Magnesium Glycate supplement

* Earplugs- https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0015TBGR6

* And finally, a recent addition that I’ve fallen in love with is sleep ear buds: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DT9GBFQ2

Although, I would wait on getting sleep ear buds, Anker just announced a new model with ANC and a similar price.

A lot of folks are talking about the “consistency” of a sound (constant white noise vs random sounds) and its volume, but I feel like the nature of the sound matters a lot more.

I’ll respond much differently to my bedroom door opening or a voice speaking than I do a bus outside.

It reminds me of the anecdote where human researchers rang bells near bears (human sounds) and the bears didn’t care, but if they broke a large bundle of branches (bear sounds), the bears went berserk.

I feel like our subconscious is a lot more involved here than we give it credit for.

Would love to know what kind of noise and sound level was used for this test. Was it a continuous monotonous noise (such as white/pink/brown noise) at a fixed volume? Or was it some random noise that would "pop-up" randomly?

Does anyone know?

I would imagine that a noise that would randomly "pop-up" would be worse. But would be curious if that's not the case.

I've been using earplugs practically every night for the past three years and I can't recommend them enough. While the particular kind I use (Mack's ultra soft) don't block out all the noise, there is a wide variety of noises that used to wake me up which don't anymore. If you haven't tried them I would highly recommend giving sleeping with earplugs a shot. It only takes a few days or so to get used to them.

In terms of downsides, only once in the past three years did I get some earwax clogged in some part of my ear which was easy to remove with some special spray (went to urgent care). Also, I have a very hard time sleeping without them anymore so I always make sure to have a pair at hand. Also, you may have to experiment with various brands and types as some brands are really uncomfortable and hurt my ear.

Some days I joke that there should be a set of Nobel prizes for making machines quieter. Categories could include: air-conditioning units and mini-fridges, construction and landscaping equipment, old university buildings, pump-housings, etc. The quality of life of many would be improved if we had quieter machines. It boggles my mind that a) in many hotel rooms one can hear a good deal of machine noise and neighbors' televisions, and b) that some sort of noise score (as calculated from DB meter measurements) isn't more widely available for things like apartment rentals, conference room bookings, etc.

I've been having issues sleeping lately, and a few days ago, the flat below us started demolishing walls at 8am. This has been going on for a week, and I've never slept better. It sounds like they're demolishing the floor I'm sleeping on, but somehow I can just ignore it and sleep soundly, whereas normally I wake up with the smallest sound, like a dog barking outside my soundproof windows.

Very odd.

I have even worse noise in my area — a widespread ground vibration across a few kilometers, like a constant loud 50Hz hum that causes a tingling sensation in my body. You can’t even block it by covering your ears. I've been experiencing this frequently, both thru the night and during the day, for the past five years here in Singapore has affected my sleep rhythm, can't sleep with that noise. I've unemployed for the past 5 years.

I can't tell you what sirens outside do to my sleep, but I can tell you they can be very agitating when I'm trying to fall asleep.

It's funny though how during the recent heat dome I could barely sleep after sealing the windows cause of just how dang quiet it was!

Fickle mistress sleep be.

Wonder if white noise counts as noise from this perspective. Or if it’s mainly unexpected noises that make sleep quality worse.

I didn't see a link to the paper, so can only assume they were introducing new noises at randomized decibel levels to study participants.

My start-up uses sound to enhance sleep's restorative function. So blankly saying "noise at decibel level x disrupts sleep" is not true.

Over the last 10 years, research has shown that precisely timed micro-auditory stimulations increase slow-wave activity, and accompanying biomarkers of health. There are now more than 50 published peer-reviewed papers regarding this phenomenon. We link to some of these on our website https://affectablesleep.com

Environmental noise is different than precise stimulation based noise, but most of us have an adaptation level to environmental noise.

I remember when I first moved to Chile having dinner with an Argentinian and an Indian, and the Argentinian said the streets in Santiago were so loud it was important to get an apartment on a higher floor. The Indian guy looked around and was like "what noise"? To him, Santiago was a peaceful and quiet environment.

I wish someone could solve the problem at the receiver end, i.e., invent noise-cancelling headphones/earplugs that actually cancel noise as effectively as eye-masks cancel light.

In addition to sleep needs, the world has gotten noisier now that people are habitually using speakerphones in public in the most obnoxious ways.

Low frequency noise is the worst. Extremely difficult often impossible to eliminate without a lot of expense. Travels long distances. Absolute nightmare for people sensitive to noise

Interesting! It could be a confounder as well. For example, maybe people who live in dense (loud) urban dwellings also tend to have more day-to-day life stress generally, leading to reduced sleep quality. (Of course, reduced sleep quality could also be a source of more life stress...)

Would your userbase be up for a little experiment: adding white/pink/rainfall/etc noise at various volumes? I bet you'd see an inverted U shaped curve, with sleep quality increasing at relatively low volume levels, and then hitting some maximum and decreasing when it gets too loud! (Agree with other comments about looking at intra-night variance in noise level.)

> threshold effect: keeping bedroom sound levels beneath the low-60s dB (roughly the volume of normal conversation)

A common source matching this description would be having a TV on in the bedroom.

The worst is this a "fashion" of modifying vehicles, illegally, to make them sound like airplanes. I live in Sweden and, believe me, it is absolute hell on hearth.

I find this hard to believe this is universally true. I sleep much worse without noise. I use a fan or a speaker to add noise to the room. If I don't, I wake up constantly.

I wish they’d make car alarms illegal. afaict they do nothing. no one looks. It does not stop car theft or breakins. all it does ruin everyone’s sleep.

Especially in 2025, if you want to know if your car is being whatever triggers an alarm then have it send you a message that only bothers you and not several hundred other people.

There is your new startup idea for ycombinator. car alarm app with optional $$$ track down service :p

I haven’t seen it mentioned, but a few extra sleep hacks I have learned: - I use the chili-sleep to control temperature. - I use sleep headphones to drift to sleep to a story. If I wake up ruminating, I turn the headphones back on and it helps break the cycle. - Sleep socks. I sleep with socks on.

Advertorial w/ PG name-drop.

My apartment is along a corridor that is frequented by emergency vehicles, so sirens are frequent during normal sleep hours, and my apartment windows face the sunrise. I've adopted a number of things over the years to combat all of this:

- Blackout curtains

- Earplugs

- White noise maker (just an air purifier but it does the same thing)

- 3mg Melatonin

Incredibly, the noise insulation between floors and ESPECIALLY walls in both hotels around the world and even expensive, modern apartment buildings in Manhattan is absolutely atrocious. So I end up booking Airbnb's when I travel and renting top floors whenever I can.

I find the build quality of new buildings (again, even uber luxury apartment condos) in the U.S. absolutely crap compared to Europe (I'm thinking especially of France and Germany).

Over here on HN you have a strong contingent of people who push pro-density, pro-city, and anti-car. But some people (like myself) who suffer from a sensitive sleep are deeply affected and consider moving to the woods away from people just for this problem. I find the 'SLAM' sound of doors (in New York there's a spring loading per building code), the stomp stomp of upstairs, and the bass music of adjacent neighbors to be deeply disruptive from a psychological perspective.

FWIW - my anecdata - I have been experimenting with noise cancelling headphones at night and I feel like it's improving my sleep.

I'm using pink noise to suppress my REM phase and get more deep sleep when my body needs extra regeneration at the expense of mental regeneration. Luckily there's none of that random street noise in my neighborhood.

I find it fascinating that as a society, we allowed automobiles to pass close to homes

I'm glad we are finally going to transition to EVs.. about time

Ask an inmate:

https://amp.sacbee.com/news/california/article240396741.html

EDIT/TLDR: highly effective

While in the subject of noise, I'd like some research on the effect of "popcorn" tuned car exhausts on the mental health of people suffering from PTSD or are just generally sensitive.

So just use some good quality earplugs?

FYI a literature review from a deep research AI ======

The effect of noise on sleep is multifaceted, involving various types of noise exposure, physiological mechanisms, and consequences on sleep quality and health.

I. Introduction Environmental and occupational noise refers to unwanted or harmful sounds from sources such as traffic, aircraft, railways, and workplaces. Noise pollution is a significant public health issue due to its widespread prevalence and impact on sleep and overall health.

II. Types of Noise Exposure

Environmental noise includes road traffic, aircraft, and railway noise. Aircraft noise, for example, has been shown to negatively affect sleep in children, whereas road traffic noise may have less impact on autonomic activity during sleep [Effect of Noise on Sleep and Autonomic Activity in Children]. Occupational noise exposure also contributes to sleep disturbances and has been linked to sleep loss and fragmentation [The effects of occupational noise on sleep]. Intentional masking noise such as white or pink noise is sometimes used as a sleep aid to improve sleep quality in noisy environments [The effects of white noise on sleep].

III. Physiological Mechanisms During sleep, the auditory system continues to process sounds, and noise can lower arousal thresholds, causing awakenings or micro-arousals. Noise exposure activates the autonomic nervous system, increasing heart rate and blood pressure, and stimulates the hypothalamic-pituitary-adrenal (HPA) axis, leading to hormonal and metabolic changes [Environmental noise and sleep disturbances].

IV. Effects on Sleep Architecture Noise exposure reduces total sleep time and sleep efficiency, increases sleep fragmentation, and causes more frequent micro-arousals. It also alters sleep stages by decreasing deep sleep (slow-wave sleep) and REM sleep, which are critical for restorative sleep [Effects of environmental noise on sleep].

V. Health and Daytime Consequences Poor sleep due to noise leads to daytime sleepiness, cognitive impairments, and mood disturbances. Chronic noise-related sleep disruption is associated with increased cardiovascular and metabolic risks, such as hypertension and glucose metabolism disturbances. It also negatively affects quality of life and can contribute to burnout [Environmental Noise and Effects on Sleep], [Effects of personal noise exposure, sleep quality, and burnout].

VI. Vulnerable and Special Populations Children are particularly sensitive to noise, with aircraft noise shown to disrupt their sleep more than road traffic noise. Older adults and individuals with pre-existing sleep disorders are also more vulnerable to noise-induced sleep disturbances [Effect of Noise on Sleep and Autonomic Activity in Children].

VII. Noise as a Sleep Aid Paradoxically, steady background noise such as white or pink noise can improve sleep quality by masking disruptive environmental sounds. Studies have shown that white noise can significantly enhance subjective and objective sleep measures in noisy urban settings. However, potential downsides include hearing damage and psychological dependency on noise for sleep [Noise as a sleep aid: A systematic review], [The effects of white noise on sleep].

VIII. Mitigation and Future Directions Effective strategies to mitigate noise effects on sleep include engineering controls like soundproofing, use of earplugs, and regulatory noise limits. Behavioral interventions and public health policies are also important. Future research is needed to clarify long-term effects, dose-response relationships, and to develop personalized interventions [The Effect of Room Acoustics on the Sleep Quality of Healthy Sleepers].

In summary, noise negatively impacts sleep by disrupting sleep architecture and triggering physiological stress responses, leading to adverse health outcomes. While some forms of noise can aid sleep by masking disturbances, overall noise reduction remains critical for improving sleep quality and health.

References

Environmental noise and sleep disturbances: A threat to health? Demian Halperin et al. Sleep Science, 2014 Nov 15. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC4608916/ Poor sleep causes measurable changes on these systems. Experimental studies demonstrated that both sleep restriction and poor quality sleep affect glucose ...

Effects of environmental noise on sleep Kenneth I Hume et al. Noise & health, 2012. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23257581/ This paper summarizes the findings from the past 3 year's research on the effects of environmental noise on sleep and identifies key future research goals.

The Effect of Room Acoustics on the Sleep Quality of Healthy Sleepers Ingo Fietze et al. Noise & Health, 2016 Sep-Oct. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5187651/ Noise is one of the factors that can seriously disturb sleep, and sound volume is an important factor in this context. One strategy involves avoiding ...

Noise as a sleep aid: A systematic review Samantha M. Riedy et al. Sleep Medicine Reviews, 2021/02/01. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S10870... ... sleep aid, especially since it may also negatively affect sleep and hearing. ... Suzuki et al. Sleep deepening effect of steady pink noise. J Sound Vib. (1991).

Environmental Noise and Effects on Sleep: An Update to the WHO Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis Michael G Smith et al. Environmental Health Perspectives, 2022 Jul 11. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9272916/ Jul 11, 2022 ... To what extent have the following outcomes of railway noise occurred in the past 12 months? Railway noise disturbs when falling asleep. Not ...

Effects of personal noise exposure, sleep quality, and burnout on quality of life: An online participation cohort study in Taiwan Ta-Chien Chan et al. Science of The Total Environment, 2024/03/10. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S004896972... Mar 10, 2024 ... To our knowledge, this is the first study to explore the pathways through which daily noise exposure, sleep quality, and personal burnout affect ...

Effect of Noise on Sleep and Autonomic Activity in Children according to Source https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8476937/ Road traffic noise did not significantly alter sleep or autonomic activity in children, whereas aircraft noise exerted a negative effect on sleep.

The effects of occupational noise on sleep: A systematic review Saeid Yazdanirad et al. Sleep Medicine Reviews, 2023/12/01. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S10870... One of the important effects due to noise exposure is sleep loss/disturbance, which has received less attention. Sleep disturbance is defined as problems with ...

The effects of white noise on sleep and duration in individuals living in a high noise environment in New York City Matthew R Ebben et al. Sleep medicine, 2021/7. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34049045/ Our data show that white noise significantly improved sleep based on subjective and objective measurements in subjects complaining of difficulty sleeping.